MWITA MATARO
Photo by: Martina Lajczak
Justina Speirokaite talked with Mwita in Johann Strauß Park in Vienna’s 7th district.
Audio transcription (some editing was done for clarity)
“M: This is quite a special place, because there was this famous situation where an Austrian black rapper got busted from the police, because he was having a label meeting here [in the park], it was hot and he said “Okay, let’s all meet outside” and they were all black people. So then the police came and wanted to see their IDs and stuff like that. Yeah, that was crazy.”
“M: My parents are from Tanzania - J: Both of them? - M: Both of them, yeah. So they got a scholarship in the 90ies to study in Salzburg. It is also very interesting when I talk with my parents about art, especially with my mom. She was growing up in an environment where art wasn’t a big deal, it was just something that pops up in the radio or on television. But she did not see it as a source of information.”
“M: I wish that when you are running, as a white person, a successful label or gallery and you see yourself as someone who is not racist or open, I wish that this person is more sensitive to trying to make a more diverse platform and try to support. I see people saying “Ok, you cannot just take random artists because of their skin color, ethnicity or sexuality just because for the sake of it.” this I don’t want. But maybe when a gallery or label or radio platform is seeing a potential in an artist they still try to engage with that person and try to help. Because yeah, I can just tell from my side: The way I started doing music I wasn’t quite - let’s say I didn’t have a good environment or infrastructure that they see “Ok, this boy got a potential and we should really try to push him.” Because of the social circumstance that I am in, because my mom was unemployed for a long time and she doesn’t have a lot of money to invest in vocal training or studio things and stuff like that. Maybe this could also be an approach that you try to seek for people with migrational background to really push them in their work.
I applied for theater this year just for fun but also on an activist intention, there is a really famous theater called Max Reinhardt Seminar, so really this big institution for becoming an actor. And what really annoyed me was when you are going to the theater everybody is white and they are just saying “Why, I just don’t know black people” so I said, I’m gonna try.. I just tried to see what happens. And I was there, there were a lot of people from Germany, Switzerland, a lot of people who applied and they were basically white and just a few of them - I think I was this time the only black person - and there were some people with mixed color. Ok, I wasn’t really going deep into my lines but I don’t think they chose well because there was just one person from a migrational background. I think when you really want to - that is what I expect from big institutions like universities and I think maybe Angewandte [University of Applied Arts, Vienna] is really doing an effort and maybe Bildende [Academy of Fine Arts, Vienna] - but I think theater schools should try to find black artists, also asian. It’s not just about blacks, it’s about willingness to have a diverse cast. And I think people with a migrational background don’t have the same supportive environment.
J: And self-confidence, I guess?
M: Yeah, also self-confidence. I remember I met during my application one girl whose roots were from Iran and she was telling me, she didn’t feel confident applying because there was no person of the same ethnic background as a successful german actor/actress. Then she found her self-confidence with 25 - I think she is now 25 - and then what happened, they were telling her: You are too old, why didn’t you apply earlier? I think it is a big point to make a difference to encourage teachers to see that not everyone was reading Shakespeare by the age of six. Teachers should really get the political side into their head, why certain people don’t have the same quality of acting as some other people. ”
“M: I think for me to be white in Austria means that I have a really big family, let’s put it like that, like a grandfather who really lived here, or grandparent. Most of Austrians, a lot of artists have their own flat that got bought by the parents and it’s like What the fuck? they only pay 380 Euros. When you have this thing covered then of course I can work as a waiter 20 hours a week and have no problems, right? I think that is a big point, also psychologically, because for me personally it is like this: My father and mother are living in Austria right now. My father is having a girlfriend in Switzerland, he is in pension, travelling between Tanzania, Austria and Switzerland. So I get to see him only a few times. My mother is living in Vienna, but that’s it. My point is that’s it. I just have my two parents. I guess if I would live in an environment where I’ve got a lot of siblings, cousins, cousins and aunties and can also work at their company - yes of course it would make a difference.
Also talking about language. My parents had a difficult time thinking about what language they should teach me. They speak Kiswahili and the funny thing is that my parents are from two different tribes.
J: So two different languages?
M: Yeah, two different languages, it’s crazy, right?
J: Do you know both of them?
M: No, the tribe language? No, no no!
J: But the Kiswahili?
M: I understand it and I can speak in a really big accent, but I would not understand the news, just really simple conversations. Like “Hi, I’m fine, I’m tired, I’m hungry, the weather is nice.”
J: So, which language were you parents talking to you then?
M: That is a really interesting topic because my parents were stressed and they would talk to me in German, English and Kiswahili. They don’t speak German quite well, they speak English quite well but the problem is when you mix all three languages then you don’t know any of them!
J: Yeah then you don’t know any of them!
M: Yeah! Until now language is a really tough topic for me, struggled all the time with how to express myself and I am so fascinated when people can talk really nice somehow, that’s so cool. I also thought if I had been white then maybe I would be raised with one language perhaps. I think there a lot of advantages but this is just what I think, some other people would answer it differently. But I think also about encouragement, right? I think when you don’t have to deal with being different, and your skin color and with racism then you have really a different approach on your day to day life. It is totally different because you can really focus on other things. That’s why I tried to tell you with my white colleagues, that I observe with their music they are having a different approach with things. But it feels really good to talk about the observations of how skin color or migrational background is influencing your work. I am sure you are going to have different conversations, some people will have completely different opinions. You can’t take anything for granted. ”
“M: One passive reaction was when my mom got really fed up with Austria. I think I was nine years old. She was like “OK, I’m done I have tried everything!” and she wanted to move to Canada. It was really close, she also had a Visa and stuff like that and my father was here, he was like “No… You can’t just leave with my son.” That was one passive reaction I got. Then there was a strange situation. I went to the cinema and there was one guy in the front row who was acting quite strangely, he was really nervous and I didn’t know why he did such funny things. When the movie started he calmed down. I figured out that maybe the knew that I was here, kind of - I still don’t know what happened - maybe it was a coincidence. He was then pretending with his hand that he was shooting me and right now I still don’t know if it was a racist motivation or if he was just mad, I have no idea. Also for me until now it is really hard to tell from people’s reaction if they mean it in a racist way or not. But nevermind to tell the story. So he was making his hand as a gun, pointing it at me, then he took his lighter and I didn’t know what he got from his bag but he was turning the lighter on me and I was really surprised what’s happening. I thought maybe it was a gun. He left the room and he was then standing in my row and mumbling something, I could just understand “You piece of shit!” and it was like a feeling close to death, because I really don’t know what was going to happen. It felt like a nonphysical rape, how do you say?
J: Like violence also, yeah? It’s also like psychological violence.
M: Yes yes yes! And I really didn’t know how to react, I was really shocked. That was on the day of the election of the black and blue party, I don’t know when it was, three years ago?
J: Yeah.
M: And I really wanted to relax in the cinema and I just thought - wow! When then people are feeling comfortable because of the government to do such actions to black people - until now I don’t know if it was a racist motivation, but let’s say it was - what the fuck? This time I was thinking, like it happened to me many times, maybe I should move… but I am still here! Haha!”
“M: My first opinion was about it when I was younger - Ah, it didn’t happen to me so I couldn’t really relate to that. But then during my activist work with black people I got to hear a lot of stories. One story was: “Yeah of course, nothing happened to you, like police violence, because most of your friends are white!” So, the police wouldn’t be really interested.
J: So it’s different if you are in a group only with black people.
M: Exactly, exactly, because then the police would be more nervous. How come they are all gathered around, what are they planning and other stuff. I think this really makes a big difference if you are with white or black people. So luckily until now I didn’t have bad encounters with police.
M: Because I was telling you that my white music colleagues are having a different approach to music than I have. I think one good example is Pheonix, a band from paris. You know them?
J: I know them! They are really cool.
M: It’s one of my favourite bands. During the terrorist actions in Paris they released an album, it was called Ti Amo. This album was really a sugary pop album and you wouldn’t feel it’s a reaction to the violent thing what happened to Paris but then they said in an interview “Yeah, we felt quite strange to write such positive music” but they felt that this is what people need right now, thi positive vibes and just having an escape of this whole brutality thing what was going on or is still going on in Paris. I thought it’s such a cool way to express yourself. That’s also what I try to do but let’s see! I am lucky to be in a band and not just a solo artist, I think if I would be a solo artist I would write really deep, deep and depressing music. But then my band is sending me some materials which are like light and we are mixing it together and an album is coming out of it. ”
“M: When someone is saying something negative what I can interpret as negative I try not to be harsh to these persons. There are many reasons, right, why people are saying certain things and my wish is just to focus on the good side, still, when so many fucked up things are happening. But this I can tell right now, maybe when…. I don’t wish for it, but when something bad might happen to my father and my mother from a racist person, perhaps then I would answer this question differently. I am trying to see the good side in people. I think that’s way more difficult than to see the bad side. Of course a lot of people have a different experience, some are really aggressive and got really traumatized over skin color and have this extreme approach, like they don’t want to have a white girlfriend, they don’t want to teach white people all the time about their privilege and so on. I try to think, no that’s not the way I want to live, I don’t want to limit myself by choosing my partner by skin color and stuff like that. ”
“M: I think when we are all together and try to make a discussion a lot of things will turn different. Also when a friend of yours is visiting you in VIenna, you’re walking around in the city and your friend is saying “Hey, what is this?” and you never saw it in the beginning, like this building or this name. The more mixed you are the more you see, I suppose. ”
Audio edit by Urte Speirokaite
Audio transcription by Elisabeth Hinkel
Mwita Mataro is an activist, cultural entrepreneur, member of ADOE, project manager at QM&A and musician/composer of the successful Viennese rock band At Pavillon.